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If We Can Built In It, We Will Come
January 30th 2004, 03:05 CET by Dumdeedum Making stuff in 3D is slow. Even once you've dragged yourself up a painful learning curve. Even once you've mastered a counter-intuitive interface. Even once you've adopted the Approved Way Of Doing Things. Even after all that it's still pretty damn sluggish. Maybe there's no replacement for time and effort, but it doesn't mean things couldn't be simpler. Epic and Valve both have full-time employees dedicated to working on their editors which means they have some of the best tools in the industry, but both are still largely mimicking the design ideas found in commercial 3D renderers. So why not use third party software? Why re-invent the torus when you could use something like Discreet GMax? Not having to learn a whole new editor for each and every game certainly helps, but 3D modeling software tends to suffer from the same problems as game editors so it's no great gain. How about the thought of walking through a huge warehouse, picking out doors, windows, tables, walls and suchlike to slot together a bit like a massive game of The Sims? It sounds nice, and after all, movie directors don't personally build each bit of furniture in their movies so why should game makers? But even without the copyright issues, prefab models have problems of varying levels of quality, clashing visual themes and incompatible filetypes. Of course this doesn't invalidate copy & paste entirely, people are unlikely to care too much if the pot plant they're throwing at NPCs looks uncannily like the one they were throwing at NPCs five minutes ago. But the never-ending-hell-of-yet-another-fucking-square-room that was Halo should stand as a dire warning to all that ctrl-v should be used carefully. Well, apart from RPG makers. There's a rather novel idea from the dirty, open-source hippies behind Cube. Editing levels is done in the game itself, you press E and it toggles to an edit mode where you can fly about pushing and pulling surfaces about (much like the old Duke3D editor) which is nice but not revolutionary, the clever part is they've tied it into the multiplayer code so you can have, for want of a better word, multiediting. Now I don't see public servers turning out works of levelling art, but a small team working simultaneously on different aspects of a map could theoretically boost creation time significantly. So how do we take a sad song and make it better? Can it be made better or is it just hard to model in 3D? Will Valve's tastefully orange placeholder textures solve everything? What's the future of level editing? Is it all Warren's fault? |
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Topic: If We Can Built In It, We Will Come
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YOU LOSE OBVIOUSLY YOU WILL NOW BE SUCKED INTO THE BELLY OF TEH BEAST |
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CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED 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CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED |
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I agree with Ergo. I think it would be keen to have some type of "Lego" style level designer with prefabricated parts, pieces, sets, etc. Sure they might not be the most original maps, but it would be fun to mess with. Comment Signature
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CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED |
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Everyone spam morn's mailbox, please. I don't think creating custom content will ever be easy for 3D games, but a simpler "building blocks" approach might allow more people to create playable maps. Whether or not the resulting levels would be worth playing is another question. The current tools are just way, way beyond the casual player. This is in reference to first person shooters, of course. "I don't bemoan the great paste" - LPMiller
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I demand the return of voxels! Dood.
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CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CREOLE NED'S POST WILL VANISH CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK 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IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED |
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CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED 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CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED 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Well, you would. :P I'd like to see the tech level off and have a period where the tools and engines get a chance to mature and stabilize, myself. "I don't bemoan the great paste" - LPMiller
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CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED CAPS LOCK IS LOCKED 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WATCH BUILT FOR SPEED YOU WILL CUM |
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NOW YOUR TURN. |
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If level building were any easier, we'd have even more crappy user levels to slog through. It's bad enough as is, thank you very much. Life without shame.
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The problem with using an established 3D program to edit levels is that they're not equipped to do half of what a level editor does. In UnrealED, I can lay down geometry, texture it, add in sounds, add in lights, add in pathing, and see how it all will look/sound in the game, without having to launch the game. 3D Studio can certainly push the polys, no question, but I don't think it's really equipped to handle the amount of other information contained within those levels. I don't want to have to save and launch the game every time I place a new sound in my map just to check its volume. The multiplayer level-editing thing sounds neat. Especially since we're moving more and more towards systems where worlds are built predominantly out of static meshes (see: UT2K3) rather than BSP blocks. A team of talented guys who were set lose inside an empty shell and told to decorate it could produce something pretty amazing, pretty quickly. You could even do it in waves based on the specialization of those people. One guy does the basic layout, another guy does a lighting pass, another guy does scripting, etc... and then everyone tweaks a bit here and there to get the final thing done. -chris |
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As much as I would love to build my own levels, I have to agree with Bailey. Got throat problems? Why not try sucking on a Fisherman's Friend!
dvds |
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Welcome to the world of prefabs and whatever-else the UnrealED stuff is doing nowadays. It's not the most complicated shit in the world, but I'd rather throw in a whatever (mesh?) because I can actually pull that off. sunny days have funny ways of quieting the roar
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As I recall, Half life 2 is supposed to ship with an online `warehouse` of items map makers can put in their levels from desks to light fittings to vehicles. New models created by the `community` can be uploaded and if they pass whatever guidelines Valve has in place, theyre uploaded for all to use. Do not go gently into that good night.
Old age should burn and rage at the close of day. Rage, rage against the dying of the light. |
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I swear we've had this conversation before...didn't we? I believe I can fly......urk.
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You know, I seem to remember the old Doom map editors being much harder to use than the current 3D ones. However, Duke3D's was fairly simple and easy to use. I haven't done any map editing with UT2k3, is it really mostly static meshes pieced together? Because I find that pretty impressive. Has this led to an increase in output in/or quality from the community? "Dream of me... and maybe, just maybe, this nightmare will end."
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Doom editing was what the french refer to as "a massive fucking pain in the ass" -chris |
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I find level creation rewarding, but there are many headaches and nights where I cry myself to sleep after losing hours or work to a buggy editor. The tools are not perfect, but it's still fun to make games. If it weren't I'd be stalking full time. He's the worst kind of stupid, the accepting kind.
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To some degree this is the direction we went with the world tools in Horizons. You log in with an appropriately permissioned character, open up the tools window, and can add/move objects, modify their settings, change the terrain and its texturing, etc all you like. Save your changes and they're written to the database, then those changes are propagated out to any other clients nearby within a few seconds. In practice this works well, but has its pitfalls, mostly in that proper versioning and auto-updating took some doing to get reliable. It works particularly well with objects, where other users being in the same area making changes is genuinely transparent (unless they're messing with the same object as you are). Terrain is another story, as two users in the same area changing it could cause seams at sector borders, but that's more just a matter of not messing with it if somebody else is. Aside from allowing a single user to 'lock' access to a specific area's terrain, there's nothing much reasonable that could be done there. Still, I've had three or four people all making changes to the same area at the same time before, and it's held up pretty well in practice. |
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Perhaps I just never looked at 3D map making very closely, but when I tried making Quake maps (using a Worldcraft tutorial), I thought it was infinitely more difficult than making a simple Doom map. |
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Isn't making NWN maps supposedly easy? I couldn't make heads nor tails out of it (aside from making a square room loaded with the best equipment in the game). Got throat problems? Why not try sucking on a Fisherman's Friend!
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The scripting is a pain in the ass, but yeah, actual map-making is a breeze... which is why the cream of the crop missions in the mod community are pretty ho-hum. Easy to work with the existing materials, but quite difficult to do something new. Life without shame.
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NWN's mapmaking is, essentially, the prefab workshop to place things. I remember making a nice town square where I'd have a romantic interlude with Aribeth. I couldn't script love, though. |
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Only god can script love. God and my good friend, Mr. Hard Liquor. -chris |
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Lpmiller, yeah we had almost this exact same topic/conversation like a year ago or so and someone came down hard against all the "lego" style map editor ideas and we went into a big arguement for a few hundred posts. Sounds familiar....I wonder who that was? Comment Signature
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Ok, just wanted to make sure I wasn't high or something. I believe I can fly......urk.
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#0 Is it all Warren's fault? Yes. "Cheap Garbage Disposal Can’t Handle Femur"
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#45 Warren Marshall #0 Is it all Warren's fault? Yes. everything is your fault Got throat problems? Why not try sucking on a Fisherman's Friend!
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GMax and the like look nice on the surface, but once you start trying to really use them for production levels it all falls apart. Level designers don't want to UV map every poly in their map. They want to throw a texture on the wall (having the editor assign it a nice default mapping), quickly pan/rotate/scale it into place and move on. Anything more than that is a hinderence to productivity. Plus, with something like Max or Maya, how do you place lights? Actors? Static meshes? You can't. So you're going to find yourself inside of a proprietary editor at some point. Might as well just start there and save yourself the trouble. Now, Max type programs excel at creating static meshes, which is what we use them for at Epic. The artists crank out high quality static mesh pieces that the level designers can use from within UnrealEd. This is a major productivity boost (once the static mesh sets are built, of course) and the LDs can focus on how to make the level look good and not on mapping textures to polygons or trying to build 3,000 polygon decoration pieces to go on the walls. "Cheap Garbage Disposal Can’t Handle Femur"
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I just want UT2K4 to have more levels with ledges and high places so I can kill someone and watch their body teeter over the edge. I love physics engines. sunny days have funny ways of quieting the roar
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As a cautionary aside, Nocturne's levels were built in 3ds. I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
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Question regarding level editors that have been included with games: Have any of these editors ever been designed to be a UI-friendly editor first, and a professional tool second? Or are they designed as developer tools first and foremost? All the ones I've ever seen and/or used have had that unpolished you-can-practically-hear-the-tools-coder-talking-over-your-shoulder, "Yeah, okay, it works, and it'll crash if you do this and you gotta go that way through the menus or it reboots the machine and oh yeah for the love of God never hit Ctrl+Alt+D; that'll rewrite the MBR but I don't have time to figure out why, so just don't fuck with it okay thanks any questions drop me an email I gotta code some more content stuff now bye" look and feel to 'em... but with a semi-pretty front end. By this time tomorrow we can be doing BODY SHOTS off HOOKERS in some MEXICAN HELLHOLE
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#50 crash Question regarding level editors that have been included with games: Have any of these editors ever been designed to be a UI-friendly editor first, and a professional tool second? Or are they designed as developer tools first and foremost? I get the impression that they are the latter. Got throat problems? Why not try sucking on a Fisherman's Friend!
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Most development tools are meant to work first and be user friendly second, absolutely. It's a rare product that gets enough after-release mileage out of their editor to warrant the time being spent. Heck, from a purely economics standpoint I probably couldn't name one other than Half-Life/Counterstrike. While Quake/UT/NWN/etc have a large community using their tools (and some pretty cool stuff being done within it) I seriously doubt their moddability really made them saleswise. You can make a case that more time spent on interface will speed up production, but most interface evolution (outside of that which enables new features) seems meant to make things easier to use, not necessarily faster to use. It takes a lot of work to set up a functional interface that lets you visualize and tweak everything, but if somebody who's a veteran to the toolset can do the same thing by typing "/ts 50 20" is it worth the trouble? |
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I guess what I really am rambling at is, even time aside, these tools are built for the hardcore, not the casual. |
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Warren: Level designers don't want to UV map every poly in their map. I could swear that you once said you were planning on putting UV mapping into a future version of UnrealEd. Anyway, I think collaborative mapping is a fantastic idea. You could use it to teach newbies, or get a bunch of talented people together and knock out something really impressive. You could even use it as a gameplay type, if you added certain restrictions. 9 years later you're the fat kid with his face pressed against the window of The Industry. - crash
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And just imagine the fun to be had for griefers! Bleh. I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
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GMax and the like look nice on the surface, but once you start trying to really use them for production levels it all falls apart. Level designers don't want to UV map every poly in their map. They want to throw a texture on the wall (having the editor assign it a nice default mapping), quickly pan/rotate/scale it into place and move on. Anything more than that is a hinderence to productivity. At Rockstar Toronto, we use 3ds Max to create the levels in The Warriors with the Renderware engine. Likewise, back at Sir-tech we used Max to create the maps in Wizardry 8. UV mapping is a pain in the ass but I think using Max as an editor the level artists can create more detail than with a brush-based level editor. I must admit that Unreal's terrain editor is gorgeous... something that can't be achieved with Max. Plus, with something like Max or Maya, how do you place lights? Actors? Static meshes? You can't. So you're going to find yourself inside of a proprietary editor at some point. Might as well just start there and save yourself the trouble. You place light in Max and export them to the engine like with the level geometry, ditto with meshes. Actors (characters, sound, particle effects, etc.) are placed as helpers and also exported.. Back at Sir-tech we had a tools programmer who created Max plug-ins for us. |
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Yeah Neale, a game where your weapon of choice can include rearranging the level itself. It could be pulled off successfully I think. Re: leveleditors I like to think Epic made real progress with their commitment to static meshes. Not the technology itself as much as from a workflow point of view. It just makes sense to have leveldesigners do the more abstract-ish designing, and leverage the power of the artists to do the detailing. That's a trend I'd like to see continue. In my mind an even more abstractified workflow could be established, so the Reactor Room where you have to toggle things to make it go critical is handled by someone inbetween the leveldesigner and the artists. You'd have a sort of "macrodesigner" that handles the overall flow of his level, he utilizes "microdesigners" that handles the flow of a single room or a smallish sequence, and they in turn use the artists to generate the detailed content. Or I'm just thinking myself clever, in reality it's either a stupid stupid plan, or something everyone's known for years? Specifically on the learning curve and how it relates to beginners I think the latest trend towards more companies licensing engines will help improve the tools all by itself. Their development will automatically become a more iterative process as each new generation of engine is pumped out. Hurrah for licensing. It doesn't neccessairly have to become so easy so every Joe Compaq starts pumping out levels, but the more crashresistant and visual an application becomes the better, in my book. Regarding the question of "proper 3D program" vs. own leveleditor, I'd like to mention how Maya or MAX or whatever has rather sophisticated tools in place for precise handling of animation. Which I believe is still lacking in leveleditors today? Worldcraft for Half-Life 2 features a scrubbable timebar, which sounds good to me.. but that's just a tiny part of the goodness one enjoys in one of the proper 3d packages. I don't know the status of UnrealEd though, maybe someone can fill me in? Do we have access to motion paths and bezier curve handles and Ease In and Out and whatnot on the same level that Maya or MAX can accomplish? Does any editor feature such things? I'm not actually advocating the use of Maya as a level editor because frankly, as Warren said, it.. uh, sucks. I just hate the idea of giving up on the precise timing too.. Maybe a two-way communication between the proprietary leveleditor and the 3d app? You make the brushwork in the level editor, export to the 3d app, animate the pieces juuuust right, then back to the level editor to set up when it's triggered and adding sounds and enemies and such. Stupid idea? |
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And when I say using a 3d app sucks as a level editor that's just an opinion of mine, as clearly Eric harbors little or no hatred towards such a workflow. It's the lack of proper feedback that drives me away from the 3d App As Leveleditor idea. In creating a game (caution, armchair gamedeveloper coming through!) I'd like to have the light I just placed in the editor reflect more or less accuractly how it looks ingame. Same goes for textures, and enemies, etc. etc. I think it was Far Cry that had a nice example recently (sorry, can't find the link.. curses) of the game being the editor. You'd place an enemy behind a small hill, hit a button and you'd spawn where you camera was. You could run up the hill and see exactly what happens with the enemy. If he was facing the wrong way just pop back into edit mode, rotate him a bit, and back to testing. It looked like an awesome iterative process. I like Worldcraft (the Half-Life 1 editor) plenty, but it's friggin' annoying to recompile the level again and again to test out the smallest tweaks. An iterative workflow is always good™. Or, at least I can't come up with any drawbacks right now. |
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And yes, I apologize for inflicing my inability to be brief and concise upon us all. |
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In other news, several members of the Nigerian royal family, plus some former presidents and their families, have been arrested in the Netherlands. They're starting an email campaign asking people to bail them out, and are offering 10% of their family fortune in return. I want a horse that ribbits and a frog that neighs... oink oink oink
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