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Not-So-Intellectual Property
July 1st 2000, 05:40 CEST by andy Let's hope the Apogee boys and girls are sitting comfortably, because here's a little something to stir things up... THQ and Heavy Iron Studios have unveiled the new web site for their forthcoming game based on the Evil Dead movies. The title of the game, and also the web site, is: "Evil Dead : Hail To The King" "Hail To The King" is a phrase used in the Evil Dead movies, but later adopted in the Duke Nukem games by Apogee's eponymous hero. Some people have commented that it was a teensy bit naughty of Apogee to take a line from a film and then claim it as their own -- even going so far as to register it as their own trademark, the cheeky scamps. But those people can stop worrying, because it turns out that Apogee hasn't been entirely honest with us... You see, despite what they claim in their intellectual property license, Apogee doesn't own the "Hail To The King" trademark. THQ applied for it in early February, several months before Apogee claimed ownership. There's no direct hyperlink at the moment because the application is still pending, but you can see for yourself that Apogee doesn't own it by going to this page, clicking the Free Form Search link, and then entering "hail to the king" in the search box, complete with quotes. (Note: If you use a download manager such as GetRight, you'll need to disable it for the search to work.) Update: It turns out that Apogee's IP license, published in May this year, makes a few other false trademark claims... For a start, there's no such trademark as "General Phil Graves". There's boring old "Phil Graves" (#75162460) but he ain't no General, and all three registered uses (comics, computer games and arcade games) were abandoned in August 1997. According to the trademark office, this trademark is now "dead". The "Lo Wang" trademark (#75272379) is dead too, with all four registered uses (computer games, comics, hand-held games and arcade games) having been abandoned in October 1999. And finally, it's a bit sneaky of Apogee to claim ownership of "Zero Hour". Not only was their registration (#75603132) abandoned in January this year, but the trademark is currently registered by Warner Bros (#1874656) and applies to comics. All of the informtation in this update can be verified at the United States Patent and Trademark Office web site. |
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Topic: Not-So-Intellectual Property
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If anybody wants to respond to me, please go read on up on trademark laws before you do. I'm not going to respond anymore to someone who has a clear lack of understanding about them. If anybody is insulted by a certain comment I made, bring it up and I'll most likely apologize. With the exception of one person I replied to I don't really have any true negative opinion of and had no direct intent to insult anybody. I wrote a lot and I wrote it quickly so I might have let something through that I didn't mean to. Charlie Wiederhold |
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By the way, if it wasn't you, Morn, who used to say "Nothing to see here, move along" when a thread had died, who was it? It only happened on the *OLD OLD* crapper but I had always thought it was you for some reason. :) Charlie Wiederhold |
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<b>#352</b>, Charlie Wiederhold: <QUOTE> By the way, if it wasn't you, Morn, who used to say "Nothing to see here, move along" when a thread had died, who was it? It only happened on the *OLD OLD* crapper but I had always thought it was you for some reason. :) </QUOTE> It was Gestalt. (John Bye, from PQ and The Coven, now at Eurogamer.) |
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<b>#345</b>, Charlie Wiederhold: <QUOTE> You have also specifically stated in a previous thread that you look for any reason to make fun of Apogee. </QUOTE> Oooh, you naughty boy! You're referring to post #92 in "Up The Creek". Here: <b>#92</b>, Andy: <QUOTE> <B>#91</B>, BloodKnight: <quote> I would like to know the point to even mentioning about this mirror loss, besides making fun of gamespy in every possible way :) </quote> To make fun of 3D Realms in every possible way! Might as well do it while we still can... pretty soon we'll all go to prison and get butt-f**ked by Duke and his sisters. </QUOTE> Clearly just a light-hearted response to BloodKnight's comment. -- As for everything else... what can I say? Look at it this way: 1. Company 'A' claims it owns a trademark. 2. Company 'B' claims it owns the same trademark. One of them is wrong. My view is that neither company owns it. Your view is that both companies *might* own it. It's just the age-old matter of perspective. Is the bottle half-full or half-empty? -- Apogee can claim whatever trademarks they want, and chances are I'll never post anything about it here. But when you start using your IP license to *force* people to agree with you, and when Scott starts posting here with a load of propaganda that is presented as "education" on legal matters, you can be damn sure we'll cover it. Apogee was being naughty. You got caught. |
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Took you long enough to respond Charlie. Wow all those lines you listed ... and you know what.. My question to you sums it up in a nutshell.. if all those TOTALLY ORIGINAL LINES ARE SO CREATIVE AND GOOD From Duke3d.. Why Does Apogee want to Trademark... Come Get some and Hail to the King Baby. which were directly referenced from ED2 and AOD? IF all your other lines were so memorable.. Why are those 2 lines so important? I know you started out as fanboy of Duke before you joined 3drealms but ,Charlie jeeze do you have to kiss ass so much that you try and pass of those 8 lines as being worthy? notice that everyone that has mentioned one-liners from Duke3d.. NOT ONE PERSON.. AND I MEAN NOT ONE PERSON even mentioned any of the lines you listed. Hmm.. either they just didn't remember.. or.. Well you answere my questions buddy. As to your E3 comment.. Now you pulled the trigger and you had blanks in it. Remember,Dummy Scott was the one who made the comment about the Evil Dead game's worth based on others.. namely yourself it seems not digging the e3 interactive demo. So either you base your thoughts on a games based on the demo.. or you base it on the final. AT the Time Duke3d was released.. there was not much competition... No JEdi Knights, No Half-Life's no Soldier of Fortunes and others. Now when DukeTakinForever finally does get released.. it won't have that advantage. Duke3d was a nice diversion from all the cookie cutter fps available at the time.. the Humor and references from pop movies helped make it stand out..Then. Guess what? The BAR HAS BEEN SET MUCH MUCH HIGHER NOW!.. Who says more pop culture references and strippers will allow for lightning to strike twice? Especially when you have no clue as to what possibly could be released.. by the time you guys finally finish the game. A lot of great FPS will be out in stores around the time you release DNF.. and many of them will have.. Scripted events, interactive terrain and great ai.. And a PLOT. As well as Duke3d did.. it didn't sell like Half-Life has done. Or as well as Doom did. no one has. So boasting that one's title will blow away the competition is alot of hot air and alot of Dumb Talk. Confidence is good.. but the sheer overconfidence and the foolish belief that No-Screenshots and no feedback from fans about ideas for DNF. or no demos.. will hurt. why? Because everytime one of you open's your mouth and says.. DNF WILL BE THE BEST GAME OUT THERE BAR NONE.. you set the bar that much higher.. Till finally all your hard work won't allow you to best that bar.. and you will disappoint the fans who have unrealistic expectations based on your words. Mark my words the clock is ticking and the longer you guys take and bigger the claims you make.. the greater the fall you will have. and you will only have yourselves to blame. Too bad you guys didn't act more like the guys from Blizzard or Black ISle Studios.. they have confidence but they never make unrealistic claims and they don't have such a high and mighty opinion of themselves. |
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completely unrelated, but if you use crapspy, sort this thread by username. 356 posts, nearly all from about 6 users. hehe. :) ________________________________ <b>dumb·ass</b> <i>(Düm-èSS)</i> n. - Anyone who doesn't agree with me. <a href="http://hammer.prohosting.com/~badcrc/Bad_CRC.gif"></a><I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I> |
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<b>#356</b> "Bad_CRC" wrote... <QUOTE>356 posts, nearly all from about 6 users. hehe. :)</QUOTE> It used to be worse in the end on Crap v2.0 Oh yeah re: #348 I remember that story. It was basically the results of a very small study which concluded that less intelligent people on average tend to overestimate their intelligence, whereas more intelligent people on average tend to underestimate their abilities. I found it to be amusing but hardly conclusive. - [g.man]<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I> |
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How can you buy or sell the sky? The ways of the white man are strange to us. |
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<quote>Apogee was being naughty. You got caught.</quote> There once was a girl named Appril. She woke up one morning to find out she was pregnant. She didn't want to keep the baby so she consulted with her parents and her doctor to find out what her options were. They told her that she should probably discuss this with the father, but it wasn't necessary. She was also informed that getting an abortion was legal, though she needed to weigh the pros vs the cons and decide for herself if she was going to go through with it. The next day she arrives at the abortion clinic, signs in, and awaits her turn. Outside, Mandy, an outspoken pro-life supporter, hides behind some bushes off to the side of the clinic watching Appril through the window. A few weeks ago Mandy had accused Appril of intending to sleep around on her boyfriend because she was seen going to the mall with another guy. What Mandy didn't know was that other guy was Appril's cousin whom she had known for her entire life. Appril decided to reply to Mandy in a way that she didn't like so Mandy decided to look for every opportunity to get Appril back for the way she had treated Mandy. Appril walks into the operating room and the abortion procedure is begun. The procedure proceeds along flawlessly, though one of the Doctors notices a strange beeping noise just moments before the entire clinic explodes into a roaring inferno. Witnessess to the scene recall seeing Mandy running away just moments after the explosion happened and the last words they heard her saying over and over were "Appril was being naughty, she got caught!". Appril was killed by Mandy for doing something completely legal and within her bounds. |
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<b>#359</b>, Charlie Wiederhold: <QUOTE> Appril was killed by Mandy for doing something completely legal and within her bounds. </QUOTE> Mandy then puts a notice in every abortion clinic car park saying: "By parking here, you agree that it is right to blow up abortion clinics." |
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The local law comes along and says "Hey wait a minute, that's completely illegal for you to post a sign like that. You are acting outside of your rights. Unlike that Appril girl who posted a similar sign on her private property that stated: 'By parking here you agree that it is right for me to have your vehicle towed off the premises'". |
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<b>#361</b>, Charlie Wiederhold: <QUOTE> Unlike that Appril girl who posted a similar sign on her private property that stated: 'By parking here you agree that it is right for me to have your vehicle towed off the premises'". </QUOTE> But it later turned out that Appril didn't own the property, she was just trying to buy it. She had put a bid in at a sealed auction, and she was sure she'd win, but there was someone else with a bid in too and they were equally sure they'd win. |
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After investigation by the local land agencies, the person who originally used the land (but never owned it, it had never had a technical owner) had abandoned it sometime around 1977. A man named Brad came through and ran a small haunted house business one year around 1993 but left soon after. Appril moved in around 1996 and according to the squatter laws of the area, has legal right to claim ownership of the property according to the rules set forth by the USPTO (United States Proptery Transfer Office) without ever officially registering the land in her name. Brad decided to allow his brother Thom Q. to take up his haunted house business and tells him of this great piece of land he should look into using. Thom Q. gets there and sees Appril living on the land and decides to try and register with USPTO for use and ownership of the land. The way the USPTO is setup, it is then up to Appril to contest his registration and get it overturned, which she is currently in the process of doing. |
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Clarification: Appril was in the process of getting it overturned prior to Mandy unjustly blowing her to bits for doing nothing out of the ordinary. The current litigation on ownership of the property has moved on to Appril's father. |
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Hmm.. Looks like Charlie decided not to respond to my perfectly logical questions.. how not suprising.. yet utterly disappointing. |
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I'll still respond if you really want. I decided to go back to ignoring you since A) you ignored 75% of what I wrote to you in favor of trying to discuss opinions (something I specifically stated that we can't discuss because by their very nature, opinions will vary) and B) you seem completely incapable of grasping the simplest concepts enough to even properly disagree with me. I'll take your post as a request for me to respond, so I will in time. Despite what you might ever think, my lack of responding will not be due to not having an answer for you. [Paragraph full of rather vehement insults removed out of better judgement] I'll take all the flack in the world that people want to throw at me for being unprofessional, rude, whatever when it comes to what I think about you, and I'll agree with them 100%... it's worth it to not have to listen to you and have to try to actually care. Charlie Wiederhold |
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Why did I ignore your points? Very simple you based them on.. WHAT if? What if This happened.. What if that happened? Guess what I am discussing realities! Reality is.. You guys for decided to attempt to trademark to lines.. and you can sugarcoat this all you want.. when you trademark it your going to obviously advertise it as your own. As in pass it off as your own work. your excuse that well since They haven't tried to trademark these items so its open season on ripping of their work is a poor excuse. When you trademark something you didn't create are you going to post in your little ads.. Come Get Some :Created by Sam Raimi.. Hail To The King ,Made famous by Bruce Campbell.. Of course not.. You want people to believe that DukeNukem created this. The problem you didn't. Your attempting to take advantage of a screwey legal system.. and then your trying to defend it as well Its there.. SO WE SHOULD TAKE ADVANTAGE OF IT! Oh wow. Some Evil Dead fans you guys really are.. And that's the biggest pile of Horseshit that comes out you guys mouths.. if you were true fans.. you wouldn't be trying to pull this crap. In then end its all about the greenbacks.. you want money. It has nothing to protecting your work.. you want money. As far as my opinion... I bet dollars to donuts If I walked over to the 3drealms forums and asked the fans... What Lines from Duke3d are the most memorable.. list their top 5.. I wonder how many would be totally original material or rather the movie and pop culture references... you know the answer to that one Charlie.. you just want to dance around the truth of it. Face up to it man. Pop Culture references are humorous but don't try and play it off as original.. its been done before. |
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Jesus H. Fucking Christ. Get a life, people. More specifically, get a life, Andy. Oh, and you might want to pick up a small nugget of clue while you're at it. |
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<i>Thinking...</i> |
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