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EverQuest - The New Darwinism?
April 5th 2002, 04:35 CEST by Bezzy Twenty-one years old, and your biggest worry in life is the bastard who befriended you for six months, then killed you and looted your corpse. And then you're resurrected, and the Elf-Magician whore won't give back the dough. It irks you so much, that there’s truly no way out! That's right, folks. Another bi-monthly game related death/lawsuit is in the news, and this one is a peach: A psychologist diagnosed him with depression and schizoid personality disorder, symptoms of which include a lack of desire for social relationships, little or no sex drive and a limited range of emotions in social settings. "This fed right into the EverQuest playing," Woolley said. "It was the perfect escape." and intriguingly enough... "He thought the characters had come out of the game and were chasing him," Parker said. "He was running through his neighbourhood having hallucinations." "EVERYONE! OUT OF MY WAY! RUN, LADY! I'M TRAINING ORCS!!!!!" You have to wonder about a kid, killing his sweet young flabby self over a video game. Sure, there's something inherently wrong with this picture of a bright young technocrat offing himself, but there has to be a lot more going on here than the reaction to a video game, right? Right? Or is EverQuest merely the net that catches society's emotion dregs? Is being PK'd by an online best-friend the 00's equivalent of freezing experiments in the Dachau? With its recent fee increase, is Sony Entertainment providing a public service by narrowing out and offing the most hard core lovers of derogatory game play? "The manufacturer of EverQuest purposely made it in such a way that it is more intriguing to the addict," Parker said. "It could be created in a less addictive way, but (that) would be the difference between powdered cocaine and crack cocaine." I say, let's applaud them, if not for culling our sons, then for giving the media something to create a fun and stupid frenzy over. |
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Topic: EverQuest - The New Darwinism?
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I agree there's a significant difference between "physical addiction" and "mental addiction." However I feel the only practical difference lies in the steps one needs to take to avoid or free themselves of it. Both conditions spring from the same fountain; being ignorant and/or stupid. I mean, the easiest method to cure addiction is to not become addicted in the first place. In that light, warning labels on GIPs make sense. Perhaps. You must be ^this^ tall to ride the rollercoaster.
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Ok guys, listen. There's a difference between tobacco and online games. Tobacco contains nicotine, loads of it, which the body becomes chemically dependant on. Video Games do not contain any chemicals that get into your body at all(duh). Games cannot be labeled as addictive. That's just like saying collecting baseball cards is addictive, or being with friends is addictive. It's stupid! Companies cannot be held repsonsible if people become attached to their product when the company had no involvement in their so-called addiction at all. |
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You would think, yes, but that is not the way the world works. In today's world, the creator can be liable if he does not take in to account the possibility (not the probability) that his creation might some day cause some person with serious mental issues to feel bad about themselves, and thereby drive them to do something incredibly stupid. You are talking about an endless pit of warning labels! Geebuz! I mean, maybe we should label bottled water as "warning! Drowning hazard!" Or label books "Warning! May be used for a bludgeoning death!" You are talking about labelling everything for every single possibility. How about this? I propose that everything on earth be labelled "Warning! Use at own risk!" Then people could shut the fuck up. |
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Let's save time. Let's label everything: "Shut the fuck up." You must be ^this^ tall to ride the rollercoaster.
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No, a big fat ass label saying: "DO NOT PLAY THIS GAME" will do. That way companies can say: "hey we told them not to play it but they did. it's not our fault." "I'm not sleeping with a junior high-schooler, I have a life sized doll that looks just like one."
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Just FYI, the Dungeon Siege manual has the epilepsy warning on the inside front cover. Greg
-Swallow it all and be glad, for a shilling I've paid and a shilling's worth I'll be having! |
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Isn't every good game addictive? That "just one more hour" feel that's always being referred to? If addictive games cause suicides, then where are all the people who killed themselves over Civ 2? |
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Just wait until Star Wars Galaxies comes out. Two geek worlds collide. --jmc
ICQ-121684 AIM-jmcdavel U=FAG0T |
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SWG is going to open up so many new dynamics. For instance, there is a higher chance of Star Wars geeks being able to meet actual females. You're the new nazis.
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But what if I get a paper cut from the warning label, who do I sue then? Plumsies Taker!
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You are talking about an endless pit of warning labels! Nope. I'm talking about an endless parade of muckraking bottom-feeders and their clients trying to create a world where nobody is responsible for their own actions. Current case in point - the mother is suing Sony to find out what her son did in the last few days playing so that she can drum up a case to Sue Sony and some list of individuals as the primary cause in her son's death. Note that she knew her son was twisted too tight and was ready to go anyway and she did nothing about that. She wants Sony to be responsible for his death. She does not want to be held responsible for her negligence and she found (probably wasn't hard - most likely they found her) a lawyer willing to back her up. And this kind of garbage is happening pretty much every day. Somebody does something stupid, and then claims it was somebody else's fault. Can't drive with a cup between your thighs - McDonalds fault, it was too hot. Drowned 5 children in cold blood - it was the childrens fault, they drove her nuts. Smoked 6 packs a day for fifty years, and got cancer - RJ Reynolds fault, they made me do it. And your point about warning labels is pretty much already here. There are not too many products these days that do not have some warning on them about something No, a big fat ass label saying: "DO NOT PLAY THIS GAME" will do. That way companies can say: "hey we told them not to play it but they did. it's not our fault." Nope - some knob will come along eventually and claim that they should have known that somebody would ignore the label, and the company should have done more to prevent {insert insane act here.} And actually has already happened - see the tobacco industry. And if you are curious about who is next on the list, see Big Fat. You're gonna have a lawsuit about potato chips giving some loon a heart attack before too long - mark my words. |
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WARNING! entering this hardcore porn bukkake site may cause severe hand and wrist injury! "I'm not sleeping with a junior high-schooler, I have a life sized doll that looks just like one."
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Links? Witty Quote
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I think the madness is due to stop soon, actually. Okay, for one thing: the coffee was too hot. For another, the tobacco companies were aware of the nature of their product, and deliberately hid this information from their buying public, the memos prove this. As for the five children... eh, that was a pretty specious example. Last I heard, though, the husband was being investigated for his role; which makes perfect sense to me, their doctor told them not to have any more children, yet by his own admission, they "wanted to have more." I guess with names like Noah, John, and Mary, that wasn't enough; they wanted to collect the whole set. What concerns me is not the rumbling build up of talk about fat people suing the junk food industry; I don't think that's going to fly. Wait for the afro-american reparation lawsuits to build up a head of steam, that's going to be an utter nightmare. Is Dungeon Siege the first PC game to have an epilepsy warning on the box? That'd be interesting. Never mind the fact that GIPs need a whole 'nother warning on them as well; one that I can't see coming about any time soon. What's it going to say? "WARNING: YOU'RE NOT GOING TO WANT TO STOP PLAYING." Hell, they may as well already put that in boldface in the magazine ads. You must be ^this^ tall to ride the rollercoaster.
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Okay, for one thing: the coffee was too hot. "And that's when Caryn just snapped, your Honor." "It's not stupid -- it's advanced!"
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Okay, for one thing: the coffee was too hot. not relevant to my point. Whether or not the coffee was hot has nothing to do with the fact that she failed to devote full time and attention to her driving by sitting a cup full of coffee between her thighs. This is called "Accident waiting to happen." Had she pulled over or gone inside to drink the coffee, she would have been fine. But instead, she tried to multitask her driving program and it suffered a fatal error. Not McDonalds fault. For another, the tobacco companies were aware of the nature of their product, and deliberately hid this information from their buying public, the memos prove this. And since the Sixties, cigarettes and other tobacco products have had labels on them that basically say "If you engage in this activity, you might get sick and die." To me, if you decide to pursue the activity after that point, anything that happens is your fault. But, as recent lawsuits have proven, this is not the case. At least not in the minds of a small groups of people that are supposd to be my 'peers' (how low have we become?) Specious? Yeah maybe, but it came to mind so I took it. And as for them pursuing the father; should it happen - yes. Will it happen - probably not, or at least not to the extent that it should. He is trying to make a case against the insurance company that took her off meds, and has a built-in deflect there. Reparations will fall. It is un-Constitutional for one thing. |
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For another, the tobacco companies were aware of the nature of their product, and deliberately hid this information from their buying public, the memos prove this. I'd buy that line of thought if there where more cases where the person was told to fuck off because they started after '66 (the year of the Surgeon General's first report on it). I only know of a single case where that happened, and even then I have no idea what happened to it on appeal. |
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The injured (burned) plaintiff in this case, 79 year old Stella Lieback, was not driving her car. She was seated as the passenger in her grandson's parked car, holding the coffee cup between her legs while removing the plastic lid. The cup tipped over and poured the scalding hot coffee into her lap causing third degree burns. No one drinks coffee hot enough to cause 2nd or 3rd degree burns and the resturant had previously been warned to stop serving it so hot. "Our busts get bigger and bigger because they're bursting with great expectations for the future! The he`t`nd p`rrhnn vd hnid in our chests is called life!"
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Maybe it had a hint of cinammon? Sick and tired and not impressed with shoehorning art into a profitable industry.
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Cos lemme tell ya, you'll KNOW when that stuff hits your crotch. Sick and tired and not impressed with shoehorning art into a profitable industry.
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Please, take it to hot.coffee.discussion.again.planetcrap.com Marketing is a crutch for mediocrity and a handicap to excellence.
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with the fact that she failed to devote full time and attention to her driving by sitting a cup full of coffee between her thighs. Er, except she was the passenger, not the driver. IIRC. *bzzzzt* thanks for playing. Many, many lawsuits are frivolous. Are the issues surrounding them? Not nearly so much. Near-boiling point beverages shouldn't be served, mentally ill people shouldn't have children, or be allowed to sit alone in a room and beat the shit out of a Skinner box over and over and over, et cetera. You must be ^this^ tall to ride the rollercoaster.
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Would anyone else like to borrow this gun when I'm through? Anyone at all? Five bullets, no waiting... "It's not stupid -- it's advanced!"
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Jafd, I think the reason Dungeon Siege has the warning may stem from Microsoft publishing the game. They already are putting it in for the XBox games, its a no-brainer to do so for PC games. Greg
-Swallow it all and be glad, for a shilling I've paid and a shilling's worth I'll be having! |
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YES! I was wondering when the McDonalds coffee lady would be back. You go girl! I am a magnificent three toed sloth.
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Dungeon Siege should have a boredom warning. They're cute, they're cuddly and jam shoots out their heads. I want 'em all!
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It's so cool to be jaded ... I am a magnificent three toed sloth.
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Er, except she was the passenger, not the driver. IIRC. *bzzzzt* thanks for playing. My remembory told me she was the driver. umm ... shit... But my point is still valid dammit!!!! |
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WARNING: PLAYING THIS GAME WILL OCCUPY YOUR TIME. i like mudpuddles.
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Actually, I'm quite entertained by Dungeon Seige. It's getting better the more I play. |
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But if you drink hot coffee while playing everquest and spill it on your dog, then you are just a fuckmonkey nazi from Florida. Something. Anyway, in the immortal words of Dexter, you are stuuuuuupid. Why don't just put a warning label on a deck of cards and be done with it. Will warez for food.
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Dungeon Siege, like most games, is tons more fun if you play with friends. I just had a 3 hour session with the guys from Legend ... great stuff. :) I am a magnificent three toed sloth.
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I finally finished the Single Player of Dungeon Siege. It was a blast. I loved it. Anyone who's been reading PC for while already knows I typically hate +12 type games, but this one has that extra something that made me like it. It took me 24hrs and 40 mins. That's a little more than one entire day of my life I'll never get back, and I'm glad I spent it playing DS. As far as the MP goes? Doesn't interest me at all. I think the editing features will be a hoot once they release the actual editor in early May. I'm destined to make an Olsen Twin +12 Sword Adventure from Hell! .....Yet Another 0l$en Twin Approved +12 Post!
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#49 by Caryn Would anyone else like to borrow this gun when I'm through? Anyone at all? Five bullets, no waiting... You're scaring me. :( "Killing lightsabre-hippies since JK2 release."
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Caryn: Can I shoot whomever I want with it? -- Martin
Hunkalicious since 1972! |
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ummmm am i the only one who believes people should have the common sense - EVEN IN THE 50'S!(@!*!( - to realise that putting a smoking apparatus inside your mouth, which circulates smoke THROUGH your body, is going to be bad for you? You need a fucking warning to tell you this? I threw this at my drugs/health counsellor in high school and she was at a loss to explain my amazing theory. Apparently everyone is a victim. |
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Since this thread is MMORPG related (please explain "GIP". Games Internet Persistent?) I thought I'd throw this one at you. Thoughts? -- Martin
Hunkalicious since 1972! |
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I've found epilepsy warnings in Nox, NOLF, FIFA WC 98 and Severance: Blade of Darkness, so DS is not the first to have one. Kittens fucking burn.
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Dungeon Siege wasn't impressing me at first, and I still think it DESPERATELY needs a better system for casting spells, but it's definitely a lot of fun in coop. We got as far as this one funky room with a spiral going down into the ground... |
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Transmute is a MAJOR pain in the ass to figure out, plus the NPCs don't have enough sense to back away when they are dying, so of course they die rather quickly if you aren't paying attention or the Nature Mage gets distracted. I picked up Dungeon Siege and Freedom Force this week and i'm now wondering if I should have started playing Freedom Force first. After playing Dungeon Siege its clear to me that the game is basically a hack and slash without the class or story of an Icewind Dale, its just a little bit above Diablo 2 a game so bloody repetitive that I could never finish it. Well actually I can count the games I've actually taken the time to finish on the fingers of one hand. "It was when I found out I could make mistakes that I knew I was on to something."
-Ornette Coleman |
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After playing Dungeon Siege its clear to me that the game is basically a hack and slash without the class or story of an Icewind Dale, its just a little bit above Diablo 2 a game so bloody repetitive that I could never finish it. Are people really surprised by this? Maybe I'm too close to the industry, but Dungeon Siege's nature was obvious to me for a long time now. I knew exactly what it was going to be long before I put down my money. FYI, I'm enjoying the game a lot ... I always want to get to the next level in something (melee, missile, etc) and I always want to see the next area. I am a magnificent three toed sloth.
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Figures with planetcrap down.. he was playing DS.. damn lazy bastard. |
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Being easily addicted to things is nobody's fault per se... however, it's sure as eggs is eggs not the fault of the producer of the addictee's substance of choice, whether it be Everquest or high-grade crack. I've seen game-addiction first-hand (Diablo 2, in this case), and it's really not pretty. Eventually, all that can be done is to have it out with the person in question, and try to make them see that the game isn't good for them. I suppose it's easier for people to get addicted to games, since nobody really thinks of them as addictive - even if you know you get easily addicted to things, why should you think a recreational product would addict you... until it's too late? If anyone's to blame for this guy's suicide, it's his friends and family - there's no way they could have been unaware of an unhealthy obsession with EQ, yet (on the face of things), they seem not to have done anything about it. Hit me - I'm wasting valuable time.
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I remember epilepsy warnings on PC games as far back as Magic Carpet. Dungeon Siege will have to wait until it's bargain bin. Just like most games I buy now. This post sponsored by DrPepper
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LOL Warren I think you have a new friend... a short hairy smelly one with green skin... "I'm not sleeping with a junior high-schooler, I have a life sized doll that looks just like one."
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I want to get addicted too! Does anyone know of any, ANY, MMOGs that can be played well with a 28.8k modem? Please don't laugh. |
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You're scaring me. :( No worries, Ashiran, just thought others would also like to put themselves out of their misery early with the return of the coffee discussion. :) "It's not stupid -- it's advanced!"
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Gunpoint LOL Warren I think you have a new friend... a short hairy smelly one with green skin... No shit. Not sure what I did to attract his attention. Maybe if I stand very still he'll go away ... I think their vision is based on movement. I am a magnificent three toed sloth.
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Warren Dungeon Siege, like most games, is tons more fun if you play with friends. I just had a 3 hour session with the guys from Legend ... great stuff. :) If I had friends, I'd debate this point. I finished the SP mission a couple days ago, then blasted through the MP in four hours with my imported primary character from the SP. Final conclusion: GPG made an amazingly powerful engine with a good interface, some AI issues, and never got around to writing a plot for either of the worlds. Though the books some characters carry when you hire them hinted that there were plans to implement something a bit more involving at some point. Oh, and the guy who did the soundtrack (Lennie something?) rocks your symphonic ass off. Siegelets might be somewhat viable, but I'm not willing to wade through all the crap to find one or two ones of merit. Apparently recession means pop-up windows.
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By the way Bezzy the main reason I posted to this thread was the rather excellent topic title! Well done old man. "It was when I found out I could make mistakes that I knew I was on to something."
-Ornette Coleman |
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