|
| T O P I C | |
|
Hail to the lawyers, baby!
November 30th 2000, 19:51 CET by Andy Time for a quick update on 3DRealms' trademark shenanigans... For those who don't know, the phrase "Hail To The King" was used in an Evil Dead film. (It was also used by Elvis, and no doubt a few real kings too, but that's beside the point.) The guys at Apogee/3DR liked Evil Dead so they took the King line and gave it to Duke Nukem. Then they decided to claim "prior use" and trademark the line, which pretty much everyone agrees was a sucky legal stunt. Back in July we reported that the "Hail To The King" trademark was owned by THQ, publisher of the Evil Dead computer game, despite Apogee claiming otherwise in their intellectual property license. Apogee's Scott Miller said that although THQ's claim was listed in the US patent office database, it would be challenged by Apogee, and of course he expected THQ's registration to be overturned. Four months later, THQ's registration is still listed, but another two have turned up. Both are 'owned' by Apogee, or rather, they're owned by: "Apogee Software, Ltd. composed of the following general partner: Action Entertainment Software, Inc., which is a corporation organized under the laws of the State of Texas." They were actually filed before we covered the story in July, but weren't listed in the database at that time. One registration is for "Hail To The King" in the categories of videos and laser discs, television, "computer games provided and played through a global computer network" and "performances by a musical rock group". (THQ's registration covers the general category of computer and console games.) The other registration is for the full "Hail To The King, Baby!". It covers a huge range of products in over 30 categories, including computer games, mouse pads, magazines, children's colouring and activity books, "news sheets and news bulletins featuring computer game characters", greetings cards, newspaper comic strips and clothing. And stick-on tattoos. And bathroom tissues. And a lot more. It's not known if Apogee's challenge to the THQ's ownership of "Hail To The King" has either failed or succeeded yet, or how it's progressing. As for why Apogee believes it has a claim to the full "Baby!" line in the other categories, especially TV and video cassettes with a first use date of April 1998, that's anyone's guess... Apogee/3DR declined to comment on any of these points. George Broussard said: "We are not going to discuss ongoing business issues. These matters are simply nobody's business but ours at the moment." (In the context of the e-mail exchange yesterday, that wasn't as curt as it may appear.) If you know of any other strange or controvserial trademark/patent claims by games or software companies, let me know. Everything apart from One-Click please. :-) |
| C O M M E N T S |
|
Home »
Topic: Hail to the lawyers, baby!
|«« - Previous Page - Next Page - »»| |
|
I remember the seeing screenshots of Duke with a chainsaw that appeared to be attached to his arm. Now if Duke had just been holding on to it there would not be a problem. But the fact that the saw is *attached* to his arm (exactly like Evil Dead 2, and Army of Darkness) shows even there you are ripping off Ash from the Evil Dead movies. You guys are uncreative morons that just happen to have some money left over from a 6 year old game, and many bad console ports. You have produced not one inspiring thing in a LONG time (if ever, and that is highly questionable). So stealing ideas from some 'unknown' B-movie is the only way you can "create" anything. Now I am positive. I will not be buying DNF no matter what. Just hearing all this hippocritical bullshit from you has convinced me you guys are just uncreative, lawyer hungry gimps. Fine, don't buy DNF. Spare us from your whining. ;) Duke Nukem 3D is 4 years old. I STILL PLAY IT EVEN TODAY. DN3D was fun, and basically kicked major league ass. The console ports were also fun, too. I liked Time To Kill myself. No offense, EvilE, but you sound like the Anti-Monolith trolls over Blood 2. :P |
|
Hear, hear, Evilive! I don't think they "ripped off" so much as paid homage, at least in the beginning. They later trademarked the lines for games (yeah, I understand that part, Scott) because they could--trademark law allowed it, whether it was right or wrong. |
|
Whatever man. Different strokes for different folks. I just think it is bullshit how they ripped off the whole Duke character from the Evil Dead films. And now they act like they should have a trade mark on all the things they stole. And on top of that they have this attitude about it like their shit doesn't stink. |
|
Ergo, At first I can see how they probably were paying homage to the movies. But now they act as if they created it all themselves. And for the laws, that aspect doesn't interest me at all. Laws are fucked. You can find a loophole in any law if you dig deep enough. People get screwed every day because of laws. I am just stating that no matter what the laws are, 3DR is wrong, and highly uncreative. |
|
Read my earlier post again. I'm agreeing with you on the homage thing. :-) |
|
They later trademarked the lines for games (yeah, I understand that part, Scott) because they could--trademark law allowed it, whether it was right or wrong. No, we trademarked them because we were using them for marketing and advertising purposes. That's the *only* reason you trademark something and the reason we trademarked them. A couple of lines from the hundreds in the game became really popular with the Duke players and so we use that to help further identify him. And on top of that they have this attitude about it like their shit doesn't stink. I just took a shit and it stunk. And I knew it stunk. So, no... you are way freaking wrong there bub. Ergo, At first I can see how they probably were paying homage to the movies. But now they act as if they created it all themselves. No, that's not the case at all. When you trademark something you aren't saying "I invented this". That has never been the case. What you are saying is "I intend to/I have been using this to distinguish my product for marketing/advertising purposes". A trademark is not there to show who invented a phrase, it's there to protect people who want to use that phrase/image/whatever to sell their product. We have never claimed to have invented the phrase "Hail to the king, baby" and never will. We do use it to sell the game though because Duke players who have and more importantly HAVEN'T see the Evil Dead movies recognize it as a part of him they thought was cool. And for the laws, that aspect doesn't interest me at all. Laws are fucked. You can find a loophole in any law if you dig deep enough. People get screwed every day because of laws. I am just stating that no matter what the laws are, 3DR is wrong, and highly uncreative. Heh, remember that the next time a law protects you. As for our situation... we didn't even have to look for a loophole, there was no reason to. And as for uncreative, if that's the case then I assume you'll have no problem telling me what we ripped off for every line of Dialog in Duke 3D as well as all the different characters/locations/weapons/items. I can understand people who think it is in bad taste to trademark it, but to get this much vitrol over it is just plain silly and most of it is derived for ignorance. Charlie Wiederhold |
|
I remember the seeing screenshots of Duke with a chainsaw that appeared to be attached to his arm. Now if Duke had just been holding on to it there would not be a problem. But the fact that the saw is *attached* to his arm (exactly like Evil Dead 2, and Army of Darkness) shows even there you are ripping off Ash from the Evil Dead movies. Do you know HOW Duke aquires that chainsaw? No, I think not. How do you know he doesn't get it off of a crazed Bruce Cambell fan who has come to kill Duke for saying "Hail to the King, Baby" one too many times? Or that he didn't pick it up off of a display for Army of Darkness IV? Or any number of things that would be A) really funny and B) give the proper credit/homage for having it there? Sure, it's great to get all pissed off about this stuff but man, I don't see how anyone can allow themselves to get so worked up over things when they *know* they don't even know half of the story/situation. Charlie Wiederhold |
|
This is an honest question to the 3drealms folks. What would happen in the case that the EvilDead people wished to release a video game? I'm sure they would want to use the quotes from their films in their video game. There might already be an EvilDead game, I don't know... I'm not flaming here, I admit to not knowing trademark law and am curious. thanks |
|
"I remember the seeing screenshots of Duke with a chainsaw that appeared to be attached to his arm. Now if Duke had just been holding on to it there would not be a problem. But the fact that the saw is *attached* to his arm (exactly like Evil Dead 2, and Army of Darkness) shows even there you are ripping off Ash from the Evil Dead movies." I completely agree with you on this point -- it would make me sick if DNF has Duke with that chain saw, and internally I've argued against it. Personally, I know that if DNF is released with that style of chainsaw we'll be ripped to shreds by public and press alike. Your other arguments are flawed, but I do not have time to dispute them. Scott |
|
"That's because we want to protect ourselves from having other game companies use this phrase. For example, let's say Raven releases a game with an action hero who says "Hail to the king" and "Come get some," etc.--that wouldn't be right, would it?" So whoever steals it first gets it. If I stole something and called it my own, I wouldn't want someone to steal it and call it THEIR OWN. They'd be ripping me off!!!!!!!!!!! I stole it first. When you have to copyright the phrases you stole to protect other people from stealing them again, you need some originality. The only thing 3dRealms came up with on their own is the stupidest name ever (Duke Nukem), and police who are literal pigs!!!! get it?? Fucking sad. |
|
Foot, there's a game called Evil Dead: Hail to the King by THQ. I think they stole the name from 3dsRealms. |
|
You should look up the term "scope" mister_pianist. Charlie Wiederhold |
|
[33] Johan "Hehe, didn't know you guys had a sense of humor..." You never played one of their games then... killing the energizer bunny is what got me hooked on Duke Nukem! [39] DukeNukem "I know your smarter than that" You also ought to know Hulka has a sense of humor, screw smileys. NOT jokingly, I don't understand why you guys set yourselves up for a shitstorm of negative publicity for ... what? What good is trademarking that phrase? I'm genuinely confused here. You explain the "how" pretty well, but not the "why". [47] DukeNukem "That's because we want to protect ourselves from having other game companies use this phrase... -that wouldn't be right, would it?" How would it hurt your sales? Trademarking the name "duke nukem" makes sense. Trademarking "hail to the lamer" doesn't. [50] Hulka "God! Some people." You tell 'im, Sarge! Make 'em give ya 20 (pushups that is, for the military impaired crappers) 62] Foot ...asked a question that I, too, am curious about. [63] DukeNukem "Your other arguments are flawed, but I do not have time to dispute them." That's a copout. Come back when you have more time, dude. Now, George, Scott, Charlie, you guys know I'm a long tiome DN fan who has been playing Nukem since some of these guys have been in grade school (and maybe even in diapers), and will buy dn4, but I really am a bit confused here. -steve |
|
ps- 'scuse me, I have a bunch of typos to fix elsewhere... |
|
"So whoever steals it first gets it. If I stole something and called it my own, I wouldn't want someone to steal it and call it THEIR OWN. They'd be ripping me off!!!!!!!!!!! I stole it first." A clear display of cluelessness at work. This is why it's almost pointless to discuss legal matters in a non-legally educated forum, people just get too confused to make any sense. Anyone want to discuss M-Theory, more specifically relating to the quantum super symmetry aspects of gravity? I think I'd find more intelligent discussion here on this topic. ;-) Scott |
|
I love everybody ;) |
|
Scott, you read my post exactly backwards - assumptions eh : )? I had thought that this whole mess started with 3dr being the target of a lawsuit by the movie makers - admittedly I have not really paid attention though. |
|
I completely agree with you on this point -- it would make me sick if DNF has Duke with that chain saw, and internally I've argued against it. Personally, I know that if DNF is released with that style of chainsaw we'll be ripped to shreds by public and press alike. You mean that screenshot was for real? I'd always assumed it was just a funny prank someone did lampooning Duke's use of the Evil Dead material. Maybe I'll just keep on believing it was a prank, the alternative is just too lame to imagine. |
|
scope n. The range of one's perceptions, thoughts, or actions. Breadth or opportunity to function. The area covered by a given activity or subject. The length or sweep of a mooring cable. Informal. A viewing instrument such as a periscope, microscope, or telescope. Look up latrociny you dumb fucking retarded robocop. |
|
Hey George, two words: diet. |
|
[65] mister_pianist Foot, there's a game called Evil Dead: Hail to the King by THQ. I think they stole the name from 3dsRealms. So, 3drealms representatives, I'll rephrase my previously unanswered question. When THQ got the green light to create an EvilDead game, did they have to recieve your permission to use "Hail to the King" (tm) ["Hail to the King" is a trademark of 3drealms Inc. and is used here without permission] :) |
|
Scott, I am not disputing legality. I understand what you are trying to say. If Steven Seagals's immortal line from The Glimmer Man, "My friend here is a little bit country, I'm a little bit rock 'n' roll" was not specifically trademarked for use in toiletry products you could (and probably would) copyright it and put it on TP so I could wipe my ass with the "Rock 'n' Roll", and then it would be your own phrase. For toiletries. And you would be pat yourself on the back and say, "Man I invented a good phrase. For toiletries." And you'd still be a plagiarizing fucking moron. 3drealms will probably start stealing Glimmer Man quotes now because they have no fucking imagination and any direction they once had is but a memory. WELL HERE'S ONE TO PUT ON THE FRONT OF THE LIMITED EDITION TIN BOX: NO MOTHERFUCKER,I DIDN'T SAY TOMATO, I SAID TERRORISTS. |
|
scope n. The range of one's perceptions, thoughts, or actions. Breadth or opportunity to function. The area covered by a given activity or subject. The length or sweep of a mooring cable. Informal. A viewing instrument such as a periscope, microscope, or telescope. Just in case you were too angry to notice it. Charlie Wiederhold |
|
CharlieWiederhold whined: You think they would have used it if the British or Elvis (sometimes I have a problem telling the difference) hadn't used it first? They (Sam Raimi] didn't try to trademark it, did they? 3drealms did, and then Big George tried to pass it of as it wasn't completely stolen. Let's take a look at the math: 2 parts Wolfenstein 1 part Bruce Campbell in Evil Dead 1 part Strip Club (pure genius) ------------------------------ = Every Duke Nukem game You 3drealms boys pulled a super scumbag move there. You can't defend it, no matter how you look at it. |
|
You 3drealms boys pulled a super scumbag move there. You can't defend it, no matter how you look at it. Idiot. :P |
|
Idiot. :P I think this may actually mean "I like Duke Nukem, and since you don't, I don't like you." |
|
You 3drealms boys pulled a super scumbag move there. You can't defend it, no matter how you look at it. Actually we can, and we have. It boils down to people just think it wasn't a very nice thing to do, which is fine. Doing it protects us from someone making a Duke Nukem clone and using the things that identify Duke the most to market it and advertise it. That's what it is there for and the reason for getting it. This way someone even slimier and scumbaggier than us can't make a blonde buff guy who wears a blue tanktop and leather pants and goes by the name as "Dude Nukum" spouting "Hail to the King, Baby!". This is the reason any trademark exists. It's not a nice reason but it is a *valid* reason. Duke is not an Ash clone, and I'll be glad to go head to head with the differences between the two guys if you like. His use of that line is nothing like Ash's even if we freely admit that it is a reference to and inspired by Ash. Yes, it is derived from Ash, but that line has become a part of identifiying Duke and who he is. Duke is not Ash, and never has been despite some people's best claims otherwise. He is the sum of a lot of different parts and Ash contributed ONE line that contributed a major role. Now, the guy who asked if THQ had to ask permission: I don't know. But I can go based off of what I know about trademarks and the situation and assume that they didn't ask and probably weren't even aware that 3DR was treating it like a trademark (thus the reason for the confusion with the multiple claims for the line). Technically if we wanted to defend it we could and would win. Scott has said that we have no intentions of going after them though, so no biggie there. Charlie Wiederhold |
|
using the things that identify Duke the most People will attribute that line to Elvis or Ash before Duke. And I didn't say it wasn't a valid reason. If the trademark is approved, it's technically for a valid reason. I said that the motive sucks. You directly stole something you thought was cool, and then called it your own. You can't win on that debate. Really. When Ash says it, and the ED movies use it, it's a tribute to Elvis, and something relatively funny to say. Even when Duke says it, it's still in the cool zone. When 3drealms trademarks it, it insults where it came from, and makes you guys look like thieves. And as far as the "protects someone from making a clone" statement...I guess id should have done some better copyrighting then, huh? ;) |
|
I'm just absolutely astounded at how frothing angry people get over this. And hurling personal insults over it, too? That's a great way to strengthen your arguments. Why does this upset people so much? I mean, I really don't understand it at all. There is no sense of perspective here. None. But Andy is probably having a good chuckle for dragging this out again. Oh, and mcgrew, the number of people that are so angry (frighteningly so) that they won't buy Duke Nukem Forever is miniscule. I am curious why the 3D Realms folks even acknowledge them, for all the good it does them. On Tribal War's forums, someone once said the hard core gamers are 10% of the market and 90% of its mouth. That seems about right. |
|
How is it any more their work than ours? They didn't invent the phrase 'Hail to the King'. We're not the ones making a Duke Nukem game called "Army of Darkness" or "Evil Dead". It's more theirs, than yours but the trademarking of any phrase is pretty lame. I can understand protecting the name of the game but actual phrases and what not(especially when borrowed from someone else's work) should not be allowed to be trademarked. The whole idea of owning words is pretty idiotic. Someone marketing a game that uses the phrase "Hail to the king baby!" won't hurt Duke on bit. If the game is ass, it'll fail but if it's better, whether or not they used that phrase, it will do better. Words can't help or hurt, anyone that thinks they can probably has an inferior product and needs any advantage they can get. Technically if we wanted to defend it we could and would win. Scott has said that we have no intentions of going after them though, so no biggie there. That's the problem. You take the phrase from Evil Dead, you trademark it, some company makes a Evil Dead game and has to worry about being sued for keeping it true to the movie. There's something wrong with that. Sure you may not go after them now but we all know that if the franchise becomes popular, your minds will probably change. Duke Nukem 3D is 4 years old. I STILL PLAY IT EVEN TODAY. DN3D was fun, and basically kicked major league ass. The console ports were also fun, too. I liked Time To Kill myself. Yep it's still kick ass. It would be nice if there was a something like Doom95 for Duke with a true internet play mode. Ten is dead and Kali is gay. It would be nice to play Duke against some people these days. :) |
|
wonder if Gracelands lawyers have heard of this argument for that matter the evil dead series is currently owned by MGM... wonder if we should drop THEM a line? hmm..who would claim copyright..or even trademark then ehh? as far as i know the line is accually copyrighted..and trademarked to the evil dead script.. now i know that it wasnt out of date when Dukenukem was first made... but mabey now the trademark may have expired before ya do much more trademarking you might want to give some of the other folks listed a call? |
|
OK, since the Nike/Coke analogy wasn't too good, how about some that might be a bit better? There have been a whole bunch of movies that have titles ripped directly from other media. Star Trek VI:The Undiscovered Country and What Dreams Way Come are both lines in Hamlet's "to be or not to be" soliloquy (my argument might be strengthened if I could spell that damn word right). Does this mean that any future screen versions of Hamlet need to get permission from the people behind those movies? I don't know anything about copyright law, but I'd be willing to bet that people who do make sure that that doesn't happen. And you know, "Come get some" and "Hail to the King, baby" weren't really catchphrases per se in AoD, just random lines. Not to mention that Klaatu Verata Niktu is ripped off from The Day the Earth Stood Still, and the Necronomicon comes from HP Lovecraft. Can we all just realize that people whose job it is to think about this stuff do, and it'll all work out? |
|
mister_pianist wrote: Look up latrociny you dumb fucking retarded robocop. You might be surprised to discover that knowing Latin doesn't mean you automatically win an argument. |
|
Deustrae wrote: Not to mention that Klaatu Verata Niktu is ripped off from The Day the Earth Stood Still, and the Necronomicon comes from HP Lovecraft. I dont think people are upset at Duke using lines from Evil Dead movies, they are irked that they had enough balls to copyright them. If I'm wrong please forgive me, but I dont think Bruce Campbell (or whomever) ever attempted to get a copyright on the phrase "Klaatu Verata Niktu" |
|
I think this may actually mean "I like Duke Nukem, and since you don't, I don't like you." No, I'm saying if you are willing to be such a fanatical troll, you should be prepared to be called that. Believe me, I have to deal with worse than people like you. Barcode Boy, anti-Monolith trolls, etc etc. You don't understand trademark law, so you don't know jack shit. Trying to explain trademark law to someone like you is like trying to explain to a person who doesn't know how to spell the word "computer" about how a GeForce 2 GTS processes Transform and Lighting calculations. |
|
There's no trolling there, Mr. Intellect, it's point and counter point. Mr. Broussard tried to pass the whole issue off, and I countered that. Was my dispute about "trademark law"? Nope. The laws of trademarking and copyrighting do not offend me. Just the fact that they [3DR] trademarked something that really isn't their own. I think someone should explain to you the term "troll" is, smarty fanboy. You calling me an idiot for no reason is trolling. I'm aware I insulted Duke, your hero, but if you have nothing to bring to the table, then just pass on by...thanks. And if you like, I'll explain GeForce 2 GTS Transform and Lighting to YOU. Here's my 5 part article on it. Sometimes...you don't know what you are messing with. |
|
Duke Nukem is not my hero. I like Duke Nukem 3D, and I still play it, and it's fun. If you want me to name a game "hero", it would have to be Deus Ex's JC Denton. Just the fact that they [3DR] trademarked something that really isn't their own. Sam Raimi didn't trademark it first. That was his mistake in the first place. Sometimes...you don't know what you are messing with. And sometimes, you need to know that acting like an asshole usually gets and equal reaction from other people. Mr. Intellect, it's point and counter point. Mr. Broussard tried to pass the whole issue off, and I countered that And that includes calling George Broussard a lying, thieving whore? That's more than a counter. Btw, if you are done being an asshole by making assumptions about Duke Nukem being a game charactor hero of mine (he's not, but it's funny to hear his taunts and to shoot out toilets and so on ;), I'll let it go past, shall we? :P |
|
I love everybody. |
|
[78] gnoleb "2 parts Wolfenstein..." Gees, you kids today... the Duke was an EGA, PC Speaker-sound side scroller. Duke was Wolfie's daddy. [81] CharlieWiederhold "Actually we can [defend it], and we have." I'm starting to see that nobody seems to be understanding anybody here. Seeing you guys' twisted sense of humor (I personaly LIKE twisted humor) I'm beginning to wonderif the trademark itself isn't a joke? I don't see anybody getting sued here. You have defended yourself legally and logically, but these guys are pissed (I don't understand that either) and you're doing a puiss poor job of defending yourselves against their vitriol. "This way someone even slimier and scumbaggier than us can't make a blonde buff guy who wears a blue tanktop and leather pants and goes by the name as "Dude Nukum" spouting "Hail to the King, Baby!". Maybe not, but they can make a blond guy with a leather shirt and blue jeans and goes by the name of "Mike Didim" spouting "Hail to Elvis, baby... I have left the building". What would happen to such a company in th epublic's eye (unless it was clearly a "homage" or parody) would be much worse than your lawyer could do. "Scott has said that we have no intentions of going after them." So what are these people so worked up about? [83] CreoleNed "Oh, and mcgrew, the number of people that are so angry (frighteningly so) that they won't buy Duke Nukem Forever is miniscule. I am curious why the 3D Realms folks even acknowledge them" I think you're probably right; it doesn't piss me off, hell I never even saw the Ash movie and don't think many other people did either. I just think it's not a good idea to give people a negative impression of your company. I think if there were a threat of DN being "cloned", 3dr would have plenty of ammo without trademarking the Ash line. Like I said, they need a lawyer with more imagination and less paranoia (but I understand lawyers in general like snorting coke so that would explain the paranoia) [90] [90] gnoleb "Here's my 5 part article on it." Wh0re! ;) |
|
Gees, you kids today... the Duke was an EGA, PC Speaker-sound side scroller. Duke was Wolfie's daddy Gameplay...not character...gameplay. Sam Raimi didn't trademark it first. That was his mistake in the first place. He didn't trademark it because it wasn't his to trademark. When you borrow references from sorts of pop culture or cult classics, it is in poor taste to claim them as your own. And for those of you who think the Necronomicon is Geigers...wrong...it's a book mentioned in ancient arabic lore. Wh0re! ;) Heh...the only reason I did that was humor. It was funny that I had written an article on the very subject he thought to analogize an insult. Pretty cool, eh? ;) And sometimes, you need to know that acting like an asshole usually gets and equal reaction from other people. You called me an idiot, bub....you started it. Practice what you preach.And that includes calling George Broussard a lying, thieving whore? That's more than a counter. It sure is...but when he tried to pass it off as "who can say it's more theirs than ours', I think he's a thieving lying whore. He knows exactly where 3dr took that phrase from, and he knows exactly why he did it. Simple rule...don't call things your own that clearly aren't. Trademarking it was wrong. If you disagree, bring an arguement to the table instead of insults. Duke Nukem is not my hero. I like Duke Nukem 3D, and I still play it, and it's fun. If you want me to name a game "hero", it would have to be Deus Ex's JC Denton. Uhh....whatever man. Btw, if you are done being an asshole by making assumptions about Duke Nukem being a game charactor hero of mine ... I'll let it go past, shall we? :P Umm, ok. The point of this thread wasn't that Duke is your hero. I really don't care if he is or isn't. But when you post little flames with no valid argument, I can only assume you are a dule fanboy, and there's no point in exchanging arguements with a fan. |
|
The Necronomicon is not from ancient Arabic lore. It was created by a horror writer named HP Lovecraft (Call of Cthulhu is probably his best known story, and the pen-and-paper RPG of the same name is based on his work); it was supposed to be the usual text written on human skin by a mad Arab, yadda yadda. Created in the early part of the 20th century. Don't know what the Geiger connection you're referring to is, though. |
|
err...I meant Lovecraft, not geiger (writer. artist. duh) And yes...The Book of the Dead is referenced in ancient arabic literature. The name Necronomicon is Lovecraft, but the idea is not. I haven't researched it, but I took several ancient religion classes in college that mentioned lore based on such. |
|
Sorry, do you mean the concept of a "book of the dead" exists in ancient arabic? I'd believe that (analogues in Egypt, Tibet, etc.), but the Necronomicon is actually "the book of the names of the dead," which transports it from being your run of the mill guide to the afterlife to a more binding/summoning sort of thing...if you have any references on the Arabic equivalent, I'd be interested in 'em. |
|
mister_pianist: Hey George, two words: diet. Two words? Looks like one to me ... Hey mister_pianist, one word : education |
|
Deulsrae I'm not a master on the subject, but I know that that idea was not that of Lovercrafts, but like most everything in life, based on something beforehand, and modified. The stuff that I remember reading was really weird, talking about Summarian magic users who used the heat of the desert to control the forces of dead people. Again...just lore (like any legend), but that stuff (assyrian, summarian) pre dated Lovecraft by a good many years. Even the bible and Quran have some passages that take of evil mages that call upon the dead. |
|
Hey people, did anybody ever complain about everything that The Matrix stole? Or Starship Troopers? Come to think of it, I've always thought they ripped a whole lot off Aliens (that movie) for DN3D. It may not be very fair or socially acceptable to trademark stuff you didn't make up (who the fuck is using the word 'invention' for text??), but who gives a fuck if this produces a great fucking game? Remember StarCraft? that was virtually Aliens: The RTS Game!!!! I didn't hear anyone complain about that! (maybe cause Blizzard didn't trademark and market it??) Fuckin hell, the only bad fuckin thing about Duke fuckin Nukem 3 fuckin Dee was the lack of this one fuckin word.... ah, fuck. I don't fuckin remember what fuckin word it was...:-) |
|
and BTW: ONE HUNDRED!!!!!!!!1 :-) |
|
Question for George, Scott and Charlie (bear in mind I have a law degree - but its a UK law degree, so it's not entirely applicable and I'm not an IP (Intellectual Property, as opposed to Internet Procotol) specialist!). My understanding of US IP law is that if you fail to defend your intellectual property against any "abuse", it's no longer your IP. I understand that this is limited by scope, and that the various "Hail to the King" references were legally trademarked. However, much has been made of the decision not to go after THQ for the use of these phrases in both making and marketing their Evil Dead game. That clearly constitutes a decision not to defend your IP. Doesn't that mean that you no longer hold these trademarks within the scope of video games? |
|
what about "Hail to the dumb fucks, Baby" or "Dr. Neutron" (or electron) or "Balls of Carbon-steel" (gold, lead, copper, brass, platinum, plutonium, sac, etc.) or "Planet of the whores" or "Time to assassinate" (or MDK) or "Nada hour" or "Come get some campbell's (R) can of whoop ass" or "King of gore" (doesn't sound all that though) or "King of non-action" or "Pu Tang" (as opposed to Lo Wang [tm apogee/3dr]) oh oh oh, here's a thought, what if I inverted the yellow nuke symbol......to the international radiation symbol standard? I could go on.....of course, these are parody's. But come on guys, you have to acknowledge that some of these lines were not originally your trademarks. The trademarks should say "when associated with Duke Nukem or a FPS game, etc." Or else, two can play this game.... Maybe I should make a game called "Duke Fuck'em" where the main character goes around blowing the heads off lawyers and IRS tax ppl with a postal worker as a side kick that supplies him with guns and ammo" (I came up with the idea.....) |
|
I'm amazed that the 3D Realms guys keep responding to some of these comments. I wish 3D Realms would agree to let Duke It Out In Quake guys complete their mod. However, they have the right to not do so. Perhaps after DN4E comes out, 3DR will give permission (or do it themselves) for a modmaker to convert D3D levels to the DN4E engine. As to the AOD/Duke debate, the concept is not that difficult. Raimi copyrighted the script for AOD. This is handled through the Library of Congress. Some of the statements were original, some were not. Raimi is certainly not the first person to write "Groovy." Probably not "Hail to the King, baby." However, taken as a whole, the script to AOD is protected by copyright. Accordingly, large chunks of it could not be reprinted without permission. Individual words cannot be copyrighted. Otherwise, the guy who copyrighted "the" would be a trillionaire. Trademarks are handled by the Patent and Trademark Office. Trademarks and Copyrights are not the same. Trademarks are divided into classes. You must separately register a mark in each class that you want protection. Trademarks do not require originality. They simply require that you be the first to use or register a mark for a certain class. Nike is hardly the first to say "Just Do It" I'm sure mothers have been saying it in relation to their children cleaning their rooms for centuries. However, Nike was the first to use it to sell shoes. The question in trademark law is usually whether or not the consumer would be confused by a similar mark. For example, if I made a shirt with a little guy on a horse holding a flag, Polo would argue that it looks enough like their mark to cause consumers to associate my shirt with theirs. Raimi wrote a script borrowing catchphrases from popular culture. He copyrighted it. 3D Realms liked some of the catchphrases and used them in a video game. The catchphrases were trademarked in certain classes covering video games. Raimi's script is protected. 3D Realms' game is protected. (As a side note, computer code itself is copyrightable, as is music, etc.) If I wanted to use "Come get some" to advertise a buffet, I could register it in the appropriate class, assuming no one else had done so. That would not infringe 3D Realms trademark any more than Evil Dead 4 (if it was made) would do so if Ash said it. As for the THQ situation, it appears that Apogee owns the rights for computer games. If so, THQ could not use the catchphrases in a computer game without permission. Here's the information: HAIL TO THE KING, BABY! Goods and Services IC 009. US 021 023 026 036 038. G & S: Computer and video products, namely, video game machines for use with televisions; video game cartridges; video game tape cassettes; pre-recorded video tapes featuring computer games and computer game characters; motion picture films featuring video games and video game characters; television game programs featuring computer games and computer game characters; television game monitor consoles; computer game analog controllers in the nature of a hand held device for accessing computer games; computer game joysticks; memory cards, computer game software; computer game discs; computer game programs; computer game cassettes, computer game tapes, computer game cartridges, computer software featuring computer games that can be downloaded through a global computer network; multimedia software recorded on a CD-ROM featuring computer games; computers; computer hardware and computer firmware for use in operating computer games; computer mouse pads. FIRST USE: 19960500. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19960500 IC 016. US 002 005 022 023 029 037 038 050. G & S: printed matter, namely, magazines, periodicals, newsletters, news sheets and news bulletins featuring computer game characters; children's coloring, series of fiction books, and activity action books featuring computer games and characters; gift and greeting cards; newspapers and magazine comic strips; print, strip and newspaper cartoons; stationery; posters; comic books; stickers and stick-on tattoos; facial and bathroom tissues. FIRST USE: 19960500. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19960500 IC 025. US 022 039. G & S: Clothing; namely, t-shirts. FIRST USE: 19980100. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19980100 IC 028. US 022 023 038 050. G & S: Hand held units for playing electronic games and any printed instruction or printed hint materials sold therewith as a unit; board games and any printed instruction or printed hint materials sold therewith as a unit; mechanical action toys, toy action figures; and arcade games. FIRST USE: 19970000. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19970000 Mark Drawing Code (1) TYPED DRAWING Serial Number 76039748 Filing Date May 2, 2000 Owner (APPLICANT) Apogee Software, Ltd. Action Entertainment Software, Inc., a corporation of Texas. LIMITED PARTNERSHIP TEXAS 3960 Broadway Boulevard Garland TEXAS 75043 |
| C O M M E N T S |
|
Home »
Topic: Hail to the lawyers, baby!
|«« - Previous Page - Next Page - »»| |
| P O S T A C O M M E N T |
|
|
| C R A P T A G S | ||||||||
|
|
| There are currently 0 people browsing this site. [Details] |
Powered by blah 0.9.1-dev •
PlanetCrap is © 1997-2035 Hendrik "Morn" Mans
|